Curse

generik · Aug 31, 2006, 11:17 PM // 23:17

I can see it now.. by logical extension of this move "Buy ecto, $1 each!", "FoW armor package for all 6 classes, at a special price of $119.95, limited time only!"

Gaile Gray · Aug 31, 2006, 11:18 PM // 23:18

Some have asked why this is being offered now, and not earlier. It really is a matter of timing. While UAS was requested from Day One, it wasn't appropriate to offer it at the start of Prophecies. For reasons I've already stated, it is appropriate to offer it now, so that players can catch up Prophecies and move on to Factions, and so that players new to Prophecies can, if they wish, get into a level playing field in the game that is, after all, 16 months old. If you ask to borrow the car keys at age 10, you're going to get an answer along the lines of "That isn't appropriate." If you ask again at 20, it's a totally different situation. So it is with this request: The desire has always been present; the time to fulfill that desire is now at hand.

Alfrond · Aug 31, 2006, 11:18 PM // 23:18

Quote:

Originally Posted by Yunas Ele

Why not sell fame too? Most good groups want r6+ or r9+ anyways. Allow new players to catch up. This "rank elitism" is probably going to seek into TA and GvG too, so why not sell Champ & Glad Pts while your at it. I mean those things are just like faction, you grind for them. They don't mean anything so no harm done in selling them to us.

What about the PvE side of things. Long time PvErs get nice titles like Grandmaster Cartographer or Kind Of A Big Deal. Let people buy these new titles so they can "catch up"

I mean in the end, its just more money for ANet. And as far as I'm concerned that seems to be ANet's priorty right now. What about all the lag and err7s ppl are getting? The unbalanced skills? Forget that, lets add something so that ANet can make more money! That being said I guess you can't blame them. ANet isn't a charity, they're a company out to make money.

P.S - I apologize for raging at you in this post, Gaile. I realize pretty much all these changes are out of your controll. You have a difficult job. I know if my company told me to go out and convince and a game's online community that a change we just made which screwed up the game but made us more money was a good option, I wouldn't be able to do it. I'm just pissed about this change so I rage here. Don't take it personally

To be fair to Gaile and A-net the things that you mentioned won't affect your actual performance in battle like skills will. Plus, you can get rank and titles (at least most titles) without having to buy previous versions unlike with skills.

Loviatar · Aug 31, 2006, 11:19 PM // 23:19

Quote:

Originally Posted by shinrinningu

I think this saves money for PvP-only players or people who only play the game for PvP and want to stay competitive. Instead of buying future chapters for a full $50 and then grind all the skills for PvP through PvE, they can buy the skill packs for less (although, I do hope they can lower the price a bit more for a whole chapter pack) and have to own only just ONE chapter.

.

and you can be only one year behind in the skills you have.

brilliant move

did you note that Factions packs were not offered or that it was stated new packs for later chapters would be much later to prevent just that?

and no other professions of course

stueyman2099 · Aug 31, 2006, 11:22 PM // 23:22

Quote:

Originally Posted by Yunas Ele

I know if my company told me to go out and convince and a game's online community that a change we just made which screwed up the game...

Ok, alot of people keep saying this is screwing up the game. HOW? The only explanation given so far is that people can get an unfair advantage by paying $40. THIS IS NOT TRUE! (Go back and read JR's posts pls) If you are against this, for the love of god, give us a reason why...

If they expand on this, and make the Rune of Omega Vigor, or sell Fissure Armor, Fame, or any other number of retarded things, then yes, is screws up the game. They have not done that though, stop talking as though they have.

[/rant]

Sekkira · Aug 31, 2006, 11:22 PM // 23:22

Quote:

Originally Posted by Yunas Ele

Why not sell fame too? Most good groups want r6+ or r9+ anyways. Allow new players to catch up. This "rank elitism" is probably going to seek into TA and GvG too, so why not sell Champ & Glad Pts while your at it. I mean those things are just like faction, you grind for them. They don't mean anything so no harm done in selling them to us.

Just try and get into a decent GvG guild with only your rank to back up your 'skill'. Just don't your emotions get too hurt when you get laughed out of their recruitment forums.

Knightsaber Sith · Aug 31, 2006, 11:27 PM // 23:27

I'm very dissapointed in Anet

strange that they didn't put any Factions skills in there though....

Xenrath · Aug 31, 2006, 11:28 PM // 23:28

Interesting decision; essentially, if you buy, you're paying to skip the grind (for faction in this case)

That's pretty much the same premise the ebay gold companies sell on - "you're paying us for time" i.e. you pay them to skip the grind.

Still overpriced, as were the slot prices imho. My only concern is where this will lead in future, if it will be like Oblivion where new content is all pay-to-add. I've a feeling content additions like S.F. will probably be a thing of the past, hopefully I'm wrong.

generik · Aug 31, 2006, 11:30 PM // 23:30

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gaile Gray

Some have asked why this is being offered now, and not earlier. It really is a matter of timing. While UAS was requested from Day One, it wasn't appropriate to offer it at the start of Prophecies. For reasons I've already stated, it is appropriate to offer it now, so that players can catch up Prophecies and move on to Factions, and so that players new to Prophecies can, if they wish, get into a level playing field in the game that is, after all, 16 months old. If you ask to borrow the car keys at age 10, you're going to get an answer along the lines of "That isn't appropriate." If you ask again at 20, it's a totally different situation. So it is with this request: The desire has always been present; the time to fulfill that desire is now at hand.

UAX was requested from day one because it is a flawed concept, why would people have to invest time playing a part of the game just to jump into the competitive part they enjoyed? Heck, my understanding was UAS was in the game initially and subsequently removed! IMO PvP "unlocks" is a ridiculous concept.

Likewise by a logical extension of this, (ie: selling out for money to make up for a stupid policy), I don't see why selling Fissure armor for cash would hurt the "game" either, you don't sell actual item, you simply sell an "unlock" so the player who paid can go to a NPC and collect his new ePeen. It doesn't hurt the economy, no virtual "materials" are released to players using this scheme, money can essentially be thought of as being instantaneously created and sinked.

Nexus Icon · Aug 31, 2006, 11:30 PM // 23:30

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gaile Gray

While UAS was requested from Day One, it wasn't appropriate to offer it at the start of Prophecies.

Sorry Gaile, but I'm going to have to get you to justify this statement.
Why wasn't it "appropriate"?
I honestly can't think of a reason other than you hadn't managed to develop a suitable channel to allow you to charge for it.

If all of the skills had been available to all PvPers at the start, skill imbalances would have been discovered and fixed earlier.

If all of the skills had been available to all PvPers at the start, people would have been able to get to grips with them sooner and you could have started your publicity-generating world tournaments sooner.

If all of the skills had been available to all PvPers at the start, the animosity between PvPers and PvEers would have been almost non-existent as there would be no reason for one to envy the other.

See, lots of reasons why UAS from the beginning of the game would have been good, but I can't think of a single reason it would have been bad.

Go on Gaile, enlighten us...

TheMosesPHD · Aug 31, 2006, 11:30 PM // 23:30

Quote:

Originally Posted by Solange

First i wanna say i've always been in favor of UAS/UAX(Unlock all skills) but never through means of paying $$$ for them.

I think many jumped to Guild Wars because there was NO MONTHLY fee to begin with when they could have charged one like many of the other MMORPGs.

If it was their main interest to make money they could have started charging a monthly fee right away

>>>>I think thats why so many people love A.NET and Guild Wars is they feel its more about the game than about them making money...This sort of changes that.<<<<<<

They could have sold expansion packs based soley on content and new items, weapons, new armor designs, weapon designs, new landmass, new monsters, new quests and mission etcc but instead they limited what skills were available in each expansion pack to setup what we have here now at the store.

congrats! you're customer # 4,000,657 to over look the fact that ANet is a business. Let's look at just a few facts about businesses.

>They want your money
>They want your friends money
>Yes, grandma's money too!
>None of the above are wrong in anyway. ANet is a business, not a non-profit Father Joe's discount gaming company.

As many people have said. Having the skills is only the first part of being successful, after that you have to learn how to use them, and then even after that you have to be able to prove your ability to use them by gaining fame or other titles that show you're experienced.

People who are new to the game still start at rank 0, and have to claw their way up in rank and experience just like we did. On top of that, for newcomers to the game grinding all the way up is that much more difficult because they're facing more difficult teams than those that existed at the beginning of the game.

There are now rank 9+s all over the PvP realm. That's a HUGE leap in experience from someone that's brand new, and it's going to take them a long time to get lucky enough to win some matches. Let's give em a break eh, at least let em have some of the skills so they can try and copy and learn from the higher rankers. It's not too much to ask I would think.

It's $10-40. Seems like a pretty reasonable price too, if you compare the ammount of time it takes to earn that much money and compare it to the time it takes to RA or GvG that much faction. They're definitely not equal, i'd say maybe 3/1 or 4/1. A good ratio for boosting the time it takes for a noobie to start getting up to speed.

EDIT: Oh and I commend GW for making such a helpful tool available to the new gamers. It's a great business strategy and a great way to keep new players from getting discouraged and leaving because of all the players that are leaps and bounds ahead of them. I'd say give it about 2-3 weeks for these punks to stop whining then go ahead and release some other cool feature. Thx

Diablo · Aug 31, 2006, 11:31 PM // 23:31

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gaile Gray

Some have asked why this is being offered now, and not earlier. It really is a matter of timing. While UAS was requested from Day One, it wasn't appropriate to offer it at the start of Prophecies. For reasons I've already stated, it is appropriate to offer it now, so that players can catch up Prophecies and move on to Factions, and so that players new to Prophecies can, if they wish, get into a level playing field in the game that is, after all, 16 months old. If you ask to borrow the car keys at age 10, you're going to get an answer along the lines of "That isn't appropriate." If you ask again at 20, it's a totally different situation. So it is with this request: The desire has always been present; the time to fulfill that desire is now at hand.

Why ask so much for it though ? It has the same cost as a new chapter...

Soldat · Aug 31, 2006, 11:32 PM // 23:32

Well, I do like the idea, since it only affects PvPers; if it were PvE too, that'd b a different story. However, I wish the price was a bit cheaper, 'cause not everyone can burn a whole in their pocket and not notice the difference.

lennymon · Aug 31, 2006, 11:34 PM // 23:34

Anet dont need to sell rank, the faction farmers do already, on ebay...
there are many many visa tigers out there... and you guys wanna quit the game over this, cyas. Folks buy gold and tigers on ebay, and you criticize Gaile over this?!?
Skill unlocks for prophecies are SO benign as to not matter as far as game balance and are HUGELY useful for someone who only has factions. Whats the big deal, price? Consider how long it took to get UAS in prophecies, I'd personally be outraged if it WAS less.... Its fair to US, and its great for new players as well as for Anet...

JR · Aug 31, 2006, 11:36 PM // 23:36

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nexus Icon

It's like playing Quake 3 only to discover that you can't pick up the rocket launcher because you haven't played long enough or paid enough money...

So basicly you agree with the concept of UAS/X, but disagree with having to pay for it? That is a fair stance. However, protesting against this particular update is just ridiculous. You now have the ability to UAS (should you wish to pay) instantly. You can also choose not to take this route, and unlock things through PvP/E. You are no worse off than you were before, you just have an option that may appeal to you, and probably will appeal to a lot of players.

I really don't see where the downside is.

Yunas Ele · Aug 31, 2006, 11:42 PM // 23:42

Quote:

Originally Posted by stueyman2099

Ok, alot of people keep saying this is screwing up the game. HOW? The only explanation given so far is that people can get an unfair advantage by paying $40. THIS IS NOT TRUE! (Go back and read JR's posts pls) If you are against this, for the love of god, give us a reason why...

If they expand on this, and make the Rune of Omega Vigor, or sell Fissure Armor, Fame, or any other number of retarded things, then yes, is screws up the game. They have not done that though, stop talking as though they have.

[/rant]

Sorry I wasn't clear. I was raging about the things that MIGHT come. I hope ANet doesn't implement these things and I'm proven wrong. No I don't think UAXing is an unfair advantage. Your right they haven't done this yet but if they're charging $40 for UAXing (I would of said $15 MAXIMUM for this, but thats just me), its pretty obviously they are money hungry. Why not sell these other things and make money to.

Again, I apologize for not being clear. No, adding UAX did not screw up the game. I am simply raging about POSSIBLE future additions. If they just leave it at buying UAX, then I'm a happy camper. If they add the other things then yes I think they screwed up the game and I will be raged. My post was not clear on this, my apologies

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sekkira

Just try and get into a decent GvG guild with only your rank to back up your 'skill'. Just don't your emotions get too hurt when you get laughed out of their recruitment forums.

Trying getting into a group because you payed $40 to unlock PvP stuff. Same story.

shinrinningu · Aug 31, 2006, 11:44 PM // 23:44

Quote:

Originally Posted by Loviatar

and you can be only one year behind in the skills you have.

brilliant move

did you note that Factions packs were not offered or that it was stated new packs for later chapters would be much later to prevent just that?

and no other professions of course

Hmm, you got me there with the professions. Thanks

I didn't realize that the expansion classes were not stated to come with the skill unlock packs. So even if you were to buy the unlocks and own only one chapter, you won't be able to have access to the expansion professions (unless something proves me wrong).

And now with that realization, I have to say this is mighty expensive. I was wrong. To get the full advantage, you'd have to own all chapters and buy the skill unlocks if this were the case. So, yes, I was wrong about the ONE chapter only thing too.

As for the delay in unlock pack releases for each chapter, I am not sure about that. I was under the impression that the Factions skill packs will be released eventually (maybe before the release of Nightfall). If it was a delay of one year before each Chapter unlock pack, I don't see how that will keep PvP players competitive. I don't really see how this will also expand PvP and competitiveness significantly if it does not allow access to expansion professions.

Hmm, a lot of things to be answered.

TheMosesPHD · Aug 31, 2006, 11:45 PM // 23:45

Quote:

Originally Posted by Diablo

Why ask so much for it though ? It has the same cost as a new chapter...

If it was any cheaper then there would be 3 times as many griefers on this forum complaining. It's not something that everyone can just throw out the window saying, "ya that sounds cool, I'll buy it." So there's still some worth in unlocking all of the skills yourself. If I look at the prices myself it's not worth it because I have already invested my time and energy unlocking all the prophecies skills, but for a newcomer who can't go back in time and invest the ammount of time I have unlocking, it's quite a good price to help catch up. There are still so many other things a newcomer must do anyway to catch up to the level of the veteran players. Giving them all the skills is such a small part of the puzzle that it doesn't affect to me in the slightest. The prophecies skills still are and always will be very neccesary for competing in PvP.

Eviance · Aug 31, 2006, 11:45 PM // 23:45

I agree that it has its pros and cons...
Now anyone with money can just roll it up and not work for it - sucks yeah, sure... However if you are a good pvper then going up against these so called non skilled players should easily rack up the points for your fame and faction belt. It will suck for the ABers for a bit but then thats never stopped them from asking you to flash your rank before joining the group so how is that to change now?
Yes sifting through the amount of newbs who didn't "earn" their skills will suck, but its not much different once you think about it.

I am a little ticked that it wasn't something we could have had earlier... Good lord all the unlocks I still have left but none of them worth the massive about of money I would have to spend to get them if I bought them this way - 3 of the classes I have are only 1/4 to half unlocked and thusly not worth the money. However that just means tons more hours playing to get what so many others can buy -_- (pay per skill anyone? >_> Yeah and I hate RA lol).

I was MOST disapointed not to see the Sin and Rit on there though... Those are the two classes I will likely never play outside pvp *shrugs*

Once I get past the OMG WHY NOW syndrome I'm sure this can be seen in a different and better light for many who are hardcore pvpers at heart but don't have the time to unlock everything the long and hard way because their playing times are more casual than they would like because of work and life.

It has its pros and cons but I dont think that its anything that the rest of us cant live with as far as the cons go.

stueyman2099 · Aug 31, 2006, 11:50 PM // 23:50

Quote:

Originally Posted by Yunas Ele

If they just leave it at buying UAX, then I'm a happy camper. If they add the other things then yes I think they screwed up the game and I will be raged. My post was not clear on this, my apologies.

Fair arguement, and I agree completley, they need to watch very closely what they allow people to buy. They can very easily 'break' this game if they aren't careful.